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FL-Gov, FL-Sen: Sink Sinks While Scott Gets Off Scot-Free

by: Crisitunity

Fri Oct 01, 2010 at 1:52 PM EDT


Quinnipiac (9/23-28, likely voters, 8/11-16 (using RVs and including Bud Chiles) in parentheses):

Alex Sink (D): 43 (33)
Rick Scott (R): 49 (29)
Undecided: 7 (20)
(MoE: ±2.9%)

Quinnipiac (9/23-28, likely voters, 8/11-16 (using RVs) in parentheses):

Kendrick Meek (D): 18 (16)
Marco Rubio (R): 46 (32)
Charlie Crist (I): 33 (39)
Undecided: 3 (10)
(MoE: ±2.9%)

If, even half a week ago, you'd told me that we'd be talking about losing the Florida gubernatorial race and winning the Illinois gubernatorial race... but, well, that's one more chapter in the very game-of-whack-a-mole nature of this turbulent cycle. But Quinnipiac is the latest pollster to see that Alex Sink's advantage in the Florida governor's race has dissipated. My best guess is that Sink gained some traction while Rick Scott was letting his money take a brief respite on the advertising front, and now that he's back he's starting to control the tempo again. And it certainly helps him (since his ads are mostly anti-Obama and about nationalizing the race) that in Quinnipiac's sample, Barack Obama's approval is a strangely low 40/56. (Bear in mind that this is Quinnipiac's first LV-based sample of this race, and the effect of their switch to LVs has been particularly dramatic compared with other pollsters, as seen in New York, Connecticut, Ohio... well, most of the state's where they're active, really.)

Oh, by the way, there's also that Senate race, which for most of the cycle was one of the nation's most exciting but now, uh, isn't. Maybe the most interesting number here is that Charlie Crist still has very positive approvals as Governor: 51/43 (and Qpac's write-up asks if Crist is "kicking himself for giving up his day job"). However, 48% of Qpac's sample is "angry" at the federal government, and 68% of them are going for Marco Rubio... Crist's measured finger-in-the-wind stances aren't the kind of red meat they're craving.

Crisitunity :: FL-Gov, FL-Sen: Sink Sinks While Scott Gets Off Scot-Free
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Quinnipiac
Seems to be churning out some really awful samples for Team Blue.  Their methodology seems to be putting out some very restrictive likely voter screens.  The Obama approval is a big red flag.  He won Florida 51-48 while up 53-46 nationally.  Nationally Obama is 46-51, so you'd expect 44-53 in Florida, not 40-56.  

At least Quinnipiac seems to be consistent with their polling, unlike SurveyUSA, which has been mostly Dem-unfriendly but has churned out a bunch of outliers too.

23, Male, Democrat, OH-13


Rass has it at 46-41
http://www.rasmussenreports.co...

Actually, a one point improvement for Sink.


This is the one moment where I trust Ras
I trust Ras on this because Scott's support is gonna be firm at this point because of Republican excitement.

So 47 for him with 7 percent undecided means Sink could win this with a plurality. That result would make sense to me since Florida is a "Republican swing state" and some folks are defecting to conservative alternatives because Scott is so distasteful.

I'm thinking 47 is Scott's ceiling.

The Quinn polls have been way off this cycle.


[ Parent ]
FL
Ugh, Crist and Sink losing would really stink.  I was really looking forward to having the Governors of NY, TX, CA and FL all be Democrats, but it looks like we will only get NY and CA.

29/D/Male/NY-01

I was never really counting on Texas......
Any other year, White would beat Perry, but even then only barely because that's how right-wing Texas has become.

But I just don't think White will get over the hump.

Likely the same thing with Barnes in Georgia...any other year, he'd get over the hump.  But he's got a slightly better shot than White simply because Deal's personal financial scandal could still sink him on election day, current polling notwithstanding.  I think white Georgians are having to hold their noses for Deal more than white Texans are holding their noses for Perry, and at some point they might decide the stink is too much.  But Deal has a clear edge even as a bad candidate thanks to how right-wing Georgia has become.

43, male, Indian-American, Democrat, VA-10


[ Parent ]
Yeah, Georgia's entered the Vitter zone
They'll elect any Republican as long as he/she is white and has a pulse.

[ Parent ]
Don't agree
They'd elect one who was black, too.  Were Herman Cain to get the nomination for any statewide position in GA, he'd go in flying.  In fact in most places, I think that GOP voters have shown that they will happily embrace a black conservative - enthusiastically so, really.

43 - Male - GOP/Libertarian - FL 22

[ Parent ]
For Governor or Senator?
I'd take that bet.

[ Parent ]
Black GOP
I'll bet you that the next congress will include three black GOP members.

43 - Male - GOP/Libertarian - FL 22

[ Parent ]
House races are different than statewide races


[ Parent ]
3 whole members?
Golly gee! That's more than 1%!!

[ Parent ]
I'll take that bet
I'll give you 1, possibly 2.

Tim Scott is in, Ryan Frazier and Allen West are both still climbing up hill.

26, Male, Democrat, TX-26


[ Parent ]
I'll give you my own
The next black Senator will be a Republican (I'd bank on Mike Williams in Texas, to replace KBH in 2012.)

20, CD MA-03/NH-01/MA-08

[ Parent ]
Cory Booker
if he doesnt go Governor in 2011 he'll probably go Senator in 2012 if Laughtenberg retires.

And as for Texas, if it's Mike Williams as the GOPer Id love to see a Hispanic run for the Democrats.  I would love to see how that would shake out.


[ Parent ]
Lautenberg isn't up for re-election until 2014.


Ad hoc, ad loc and quid pro quo!
So little time, so much to know!


[ Parent ]
NJ-Gov isn't up until 2013
If 2012 is a decent environment for Democrats, I can easily see Ron Sims running for WA-Gov and winning.  I'd be surprised if he didn't want the job anymore, though he may have to fight Jay Inslee for the nom.

[ Parent ]
Maybe Henry Cuellar?
He's always struck me as the most visible/polished of the Hispanic Democrats in the Texas delegation.

20, CD MA-03/NH-01/MA-08

[ Parent ]
Herman Cain
It's too bad that Cain didn't take the plunge this year and challenge Isakson from the right - he would have benefitted from the Tea Party phenomenon and his status as an outsider this year.  It would have been interesting test case; I certainly would have given him a better chance of upsetting Isakson than Miller toppling Murkowski or O'Donnell upending Castle.

[ Parent ]
Gov
I would have preferred to see him run for the open Gov seat, actually.  I think he'd have had a real good shot at it.

43 - Male - GOP/Libertarian - FL 22

[ Parent ]
RE: Gov
I believe Cain's advantage in the gubernatorial primary is that he would have been able to effectively and legitimately assume the conservative mantle moreso than any of the other candidates that ran.  I certainly would have voted for him.  

It gets messy when you have four other legitimate contendors though. Had he been able to stake out a strong position, he would have gotten whacked around like Oxendine did (and it's much more fun watching a sleazeball like Oxendine go down in flames as opposed to someone you like :P).

I agree that he would have had a good shot, but an Isakson challenge would have been more of a straight shot, so to speak.


[ Parent ]
Wrong
Cain sure, but that's the only black Republican who could win.

Look at how well State Rep. Melvin Everson did when he ran for Labor Commissioner this year. He's popular with party leaders and had been running for a year.

State Rep. Mark Butler has some serious ethical issues, yet he filed at the last minute and won in a landslide.

No one on either side thought Butler had a chance.


[ Parent ]
Crist
Crist is gone.  His chance at winning disappeared when Meek beat Greene in the primary.  I havent' been all that impressed by Scotts' ads, but there are a lot of them one the air down here and he is gaining traction when I talk to less interested friends and see what they have to say.  In my mind, this has gone from tossup (with a slight Dem lean) to lean R.  People have heard of the medicare thing, they just don't seem to care.

43 - Male - GOP/Libertarian - FL 22

[ Parent ]
I no longer think Crist could have won even with Greene
Meek is under 20% and Rubio is still kicking ass.  

[ Parent ]
actually, to give myself some credit
I never thought Crist was going to win.  And then watching him back pedal on just about everything under the sun, wrong!  You were already in the lead, why not just shut the hell up?

[ Parent ]
Ok Sink, time to play hardball
Scott has plenty to run against, so get up with the negative ads.  You can still win this, but the ads need to come soon and they need to be GOOD ones. Don't let this sleezeball buy the Governor's mansion.

negative ads should pretty much be the only ads she runs
People in FL will vote for Democrats, that's clear.  If they at least recognize your name they'll vote for you over whatever you decide to paint your opponent as.  That simple, just do it!  (The "just do it" is meant to be in Tim Gunn's voice.)

[ Parent ]
I think it tilts away slightly
But she still has a fighting chance.

[ Parent ]
Game Theory
What does/what will it take for Meek supporters to decide that the best candidate simply cannot win and Crist is the lesser of two evils?

Crist saying he won't caucus with the Republicans?


[ Parent ]
I don't think that would help...
I think that would just bleed away whatever Republican votes Crist still has.  

[ Parent ]
Well, he asked about Meek supporters


[ Parent ]
"I will caucus with the majority." ? nt


[ Parent ]
Perhaps
But that may reinforce the feeling that he's an unprincipled opportunist.

[ Parent ]
But . . .
He IS an unprincipled opportunist.  At least he would be revealing his true self.  

[ Parent ]
And if you are going to be an unprincipled opportunist
at least frame it in a way where you are committing your actions with the majority in mind.  I'll caucus with the majority should become, I'll caucus with whatever the American people decide to choose.  Tweak that to make it so that includes Florida somehow and done.

[ Parent ]
Probably time.
There is still a month to the campaign yet. A week out, I think there might be a certain push for folks to vote strategically if Meek is still a distant 3rd.    

[ Parent ]
I think a good start
would be having that actually be true. I am not convinced.  

[ Parent ]
Meek's below 20%. Rubio's around 45%.
A plurality of Dems (46-43) prefer Crist to Meek.  What more would it take to convince you?

[ Parent ]
Below 20%
Only in the Q poll.  In the others, he's around 23%, 24%.

[ Parent ]
Crist needs momentum
He's down by 13 in the listed poll. I don't think he'll convince Meek voters unless he pulls to within 5 of Rubio.

[ Parent ]
The Catch 22 is
that he can't pull to within 5 of Rubio until more Democrats start to support him.

[ Parent ]
Not necessarily
It might take a serious Rubio mistake, but Crist is (at least for now) still a Republican.

If I were Crist, I'd go for the "sensible conservative" mantle, trying to get voters to think that Rubio is anything but sensible.

If it works, Crist would climb back to within range of Rubio, then he can make a quiet appeal (through surrogates) for Meek voters to be "sensible".

OTOH, I think Meek still has a couple of weeks to prove himself. If he can get to within 5 points of Crist, I can see Charlie's support melting away, and at least Ds coming home.

Meek is not all that liberal either -- per Progressive Punch, he's like in the middle of the D caucus.


[ Parent ]
The apart about Crist being preferable
Given the political winds, I think it's likely that he would caucus with the Republicans.  

[ Parent ]
If you treat the Q-poll is gospel, it no longer matters
Even were Meek to drop out and endorse Crist, he can't guarantee all of his supporters will still be motivated to show up, let alone vote Crist as instructed, and 72% of them would be required just to pull into a tie with Rubio.

[ Parent ]
That's true.
But as Crist comes up in the polls, he may peel off some Rubio support; Meek dropping down gives him some wiggle room to inch to the right.

[ Parent ]
Don't think
I don't think that this will happen.  Meek is a sitting congressman and has a solid base.  He's also quite personalbe and has the support of people like Gore and Clinton.  Many voters do not 'vote strategically' - Crist has no chance anymore.

43 - Male - GOP/Libertarian - FL 22

[ Parent ]
Does Meek have a chance? NT


[ Parent ]
Not really
He needed for Crist to take some from Rubio, but Crist moved sharp left trying to get all the Dem votes.  Didn't work and now he shows no signs of taking back toward the center-right (which might have left some room for Meek).  Really, you have two candidates trying to get the Dem and center votes and one trying to get the right votes.  Meek's path to victory needed Crist to run as a center-right politician.  Crist's path to victory needed Greene to win and for he (Crist) to get the support of the Dem establishment.  Neither happened and so Rubio will win the election.

43 - Male - GOP/Libertarian - FL 22

[ Parent ]
Expect Quinn's LV model to take a hit
tonight or tomorrow when PPP releases their CT results. They have tweeted that Blumenthal is up big. I think Quinnipiac will either start getting less repub-leaning results or will prove to be not too accurate this year.

Depends how big "big" is
I bet it'll still be only high single digits. But, yeah, Quinnipiac do look like an outlier in quite a few places, Ohio and New York in particular.

[ Parent ]

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